What a joke..

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Originally Posted by Monkeyhead

Guess that proves it, we all came from monkeys because R13 said so lol. Didn't this coversation happen before.

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No, evolution doesn't even say that, it amazes me how people think that's what evolution says. Go read a little.

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Originally Posted by 1inStripes

I like how theory = fact in some cases but not all.

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A scientific theory, isn't just a theory. It's facts and scientific laws, with the theory to explain them...there's different types of theories, people cling to the general one that "just an idea". That's not a scientific theory.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

HAHAHAHA....funny. Theory is just that...a hypothesis that has not been proven wrong...or right for a certain period of time. Thousands of years of religious belief have also stood that test of time.

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Hahahahahahahahahaha....wrong. As I said above to stripes, that's not a scientific theory. Do you think that's what gravity is? Something has to withstand rigorously tested thousands of times before it can even get the title of "theory" in science, this is 9th grade Biology stuff. It stands as fact until proven otherwise, which the theory of evolution has not only withstood 150 years of testing, it's been backed up with tons of evidence than Darwin ever proposed. It will never lose the "theory", because there is no higher title to go in science, it's fact until it's proven wrong, there's no "missing link" that creationists claim there is that will change it from a theory. It's fact, it's accepted as fact in the scientific community, not debatable.

No, people have clung to them for thousands of years, there's not a shred of evidence that any of them are true. Religion actually changes with the times, there's a reason the top religions in the world are some of the newest.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

I happen to be of the mind that The Bible and Science can both go together. I have no shackles. I have the ability to believe that there is more than just myself. You on the other hand are the shackled one in that science tells you that you are nothing more than a monkey that will turn to dust one day.

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Not really, it's a nice idea, but they don't really "go together"..or what did you mean by that? I'm talking about the thought that God may not exist, that Christianity was created completely by man. And there's the monkey thing again, did any of you pay attention in biology? Evolution says nothing like that, wow.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

John Adams once said "We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
Boy those words are ringing true.

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I like Adams too.

Let the human mind loose. It must be loose. It will be loose. Superstition and dogmatism cannot confine it.

God is an essence that we know nothing of. Until this awful blasphemy is got rid of, there never will be any liberal science in the world.

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Originally Posted by R13

No, evolution doesn't even say that, it amazes me how people think that's what evolution says. Go read a little.

A scientific theory, isn't just a theory. It's facts and scientific laws, with the theory to explain them...there's different types of theories, people cling to the general one that "just an idea". That's not a scientific theory.

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scientific fact - an observation that has been confirmed repeatedly and is accepted as true (although its truth is never final)

scientific theory - a theory that explains scientific observations; "scientific theories must be falsifiable"

scientific law - a law-like statement that generalizes across a set of conditions. To be accorded law-like status a wide variety of these conditions should be known, i.e. the law has a well documented history of successful replication and extension to new conditions. Ideally boundary conditions, where the law fails, should also be known.

As you can see from the dictionary, theory is still falsifiable. Its an explanation of observations..nothing more. Maybe, as you always say to try and belittle people, should READ A LITTLE

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Originally Posted by R13

Do you think that's what gravity is? Something has to withstand rigorously tested thousands of times before it can even get the title of "theory" in science, this is 9th grade Biology stuff. It stands as fact until proven otherwise, which the theory of evolution has not only withstood 150 years of testing, it's been backed up with tons of evidence than Darwin ever proposed. It will never lose the "theory", because there is no higher title to go in science, it's fact until it's proven wrong, there's no "missing link" that creationists claim there is that will change it from a theory. It's fact, it's accepted as fact in the scientific community, not debatable.

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Gravity, is scientific law, a higher title than theory because the "observations" can actually be observed...in life...in front of you. Evolution is a theory.

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Originally Posted by R13

Religion actually changes with the times, there's a reason the top religions in the world are some of the newest.

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Like Darwinism

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Originally Posted by R13

Not really, it's a nice idea, but they don't really "go together"..or what did you mean by that? I'm talking about the thought that God may not exist, that Christianity was created completely by man. And there's the monkey thing again, did any of you pay attention in biology? Evolution says nothing like that, wow.

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I mean, in my belief, God and science can co-exist. That both can be right at the same time. That maybe God put all the pieces together for life to exist on this planet. That evolution MAY have occured, but that intelligence at our level would not have come about through evolution, only through intelligent design.

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Originally Posted by R13

I like Adams too.

Let the human mind loose. It must be loose. It will be loose. Superstition and dogmatism cannot confine it.

God is an essence that we know nothing of. Until this awful blasphemy is got rid of, there never will be any liberal science in the world.

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"Without Religion, this World would be Something not fit to be mentioned in polite Company, I mean Hell." -John Adams to Thomas Jefferson, April 19, 1817

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Originally Posted by Shooter

As you can see from the dictionary, theory is still falsifiable. Its an explanation of observations..nothing more. Maybe, as you always say to try and belittle people, should READ A LITTLE

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Lol everything in science is "falsifiable", that's the whole purpose of scientific experiments, to debunk it. There's no step process that moves it up the ladder like you're trying to claim....

Scientific laws are similar to scientific theories in that they are principles that can be used to predict the behavior of the natural world. Both scientific laws and scientific theories are typically well-supported by observations and/or experimental evidence. Usually scientific laws refer to rules for how nature will behave under certain conditions. Scientific theories are more overarching explanations of how nature works and why it exhibits certain characteristics.

A common misconception is that scientific theories are rudimentary ideas that will eventually graduate into scientific laws when enough data and evidence has been accumulated. A theory does not change into a scientific law with the accumulation of new or better evidence. A theory will always remain a theory, a law will always remain a law.

And from the National Academy of Sciences, they can explain it better than I can...

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature supported by facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena.

A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment. Such fact-supported theories are not "guesses" but reliable accounts of the real world. The theory of biological evolution is more than "just a theory." It is as factual an explanation of the universe as the atomic theory of matter or the germ theory of disease. Our understanding of gravity is still a work in progress. But the phenomenon of gravity, like evolution, is an accepted fact.



Like I said, basic 9th grade biology stuff, it's not "just an idea" in science, doesn't work like that.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

Gravity, is scientific law, a higher title than theory because the "observations" can actually be observed...in life...in front of you. Evolution is a theory.

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Wow, wrong again LMAO, have you ever heard of the "Theory of Relativity"? It's been explained above, there's not a "ladder" that bumps it into law. Scientific law is nothing but a rule, a scientic theory is those laws and the theory to explain them better. Gravity is a theory, a scientific theory just like Evolution, which is facts.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

Like Darwinism

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What like Darwinism? Do you know how young modern science is? The magical garden and talking snakes just wasn't cutting it when modern science took over.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

I mean, in my belief, God and science can co-exist. That both can be right at the same time. That maybe God put all the pieces together for life to exist on this planet. That evolution MAY have occured, but that intelligence at our level would not have come about through evolution, only through intelligent design.

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I mean that's fine, believe Intelligent Design all you want, it's modern creationism. It can coexist as long as that pseudo-science isn't passed off as actual science in our public schools.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

"Without Religion, this World would be Something not fit to be mentioned in polite Company, I mean Hell." -John Adams to Thomas Jefferson, April 19, 1817

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I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved -- the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!
-- John Adams, letter to Thomas Jefferson

LOL...so you agree, a theory is falsifiable...which makes it NOT fact. Fact is NOT falsifiable.

What you fail to admit is that evolution is just as impossible to PROVE as is the existance of God. Just as they are both impossible to disprove. Just because you dig up a prehistoric humanoid doesnt mean that it evolved into man. Unless you actually observed THE evolution of man from something less....than you really have no clue.

Oh well...We can agree to disagree. Its obvious you have a loathing of Christians...and a belief that you are somehow more intelligent than us because of your beliefs. You never miss an opportunity to throw in "fairytale", "read a little", or infer that we didn't make it past 8th grade, and complain how we "feel good about ourselves without doing anything". Which, brings me back to what started this whole thread anyway...your disprespect of religions (unless its Islam). If you disbelieve so much, I still have no clue why you even want to be in the religion forum other than to ridicule. Why not have the mods start a "Science" forum?

Anyway...rant over. Im done.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

LOL...so you agree, a theory is falsifiable...which makes it NOT fact. Fact is NOT falsifiable.

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The theory can be altered to explain it better, that's what it means by falsifiable, not the facts within the theory.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

What you fail to admit is that evolution is just as impossible to PROVE as is the existance of God. Just as they are both impossible to disprove. Just because you dig up a prehistoric humanoid doesnt mean that it evolved into man. Unless you actually observed THE evolution of man from something less....than you really have no clue.

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Why would I admit that? It's wrong. One can be experimented on, one has been experimented on, one has tons of date and facts to back it up...the other has none of that, guess which one that is? Evolution isn't a belief, it stands as the way it happened, because some refuse to accept it because it doesn't match up in that book of supposed truths...doesn't diminish the evidence. I was born May 18th, 1990, so because I didn't see the sun rise May 17th, 1990...does it mean that I can question whether it did or not? No, that's silly and terrible reasoning just like you're trying to do. Because I wasn't alive when it happened, doesn't mean that it didn't happen, esp. when all of the evidence says it did. So yeah, we have a clue, a very very good one.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

Oh well...We can agree to disagree. Its obvious you have a loathing of Christians...and a belief that you are somehow more intelligent than us because of your beliefs. You never miss an opportunity to throw in "fairytale", "read a little", or infer that we didn't make it past 8th grade, and complain how we "feel good about ourselves without doing anything". Which, brings me back to what started this whole thread anyway...your disprespect of religions (unless its Islam).

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I would too, you really don't have an argument. I don't loathe anyone and don't think that at all. I refer to fairytales because those stories in the bible have never been proven to be nothing more than that, take out "God" in them and they're like the easter bunny and toothfairy stories. The "read a little" is just what I'm saying, read a little on the subject, you tried to argue that evolution say's we come from monkeys and that scientific law is somehow higher up than scientific theory...when I say that's 9th grade biology, it's not trying to say anyone didn't make it past 8th grade, I'm saying that basic knowledge says that's ridiculous. And I've always thought that about praying, always, it's basically doing nothing and saying you did something...sure it's a nice thought, but I'm more of a fan of getting off my ass and actually doing something.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

If you disbelieve so much, I still have no clue why you even want to be in the religion forum other than to ridicule.

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Just because I don't believe it, doesn't mean I don't have an opinion on it or don't know anything about it, the exact opposite.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

Why not have the mods start a "Science" forum?

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What would be the point of that?

To compare seeing the sun rise to evolution might be the biggest leap ive ever seen. You see it every day. Noone EVER saw a big bang. Noone has ever seen evolution..whether you want to believe that or not. I can sit and call your book a fairytale just the same. Its what a certain number of people THINK happened.

And again...you dodged the topic of how you blatantly try to belittle people because of their beliefs...now comparing God to the easter bunny. And also implying that by praying, Christians dodge doing anything. I'd wager I've done a lot more "getting off my ass" in my life than you have.

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Originally Posted by Shooter

To compare seeing the sun rise to evolution might be the biggest leap ive ever seen. You see it every day. Noone EVER saw a big bang. Noone has ever seen evolution..whether you want to believe that or not. I can sit and call your book a fairytale just the same. Its what a certain number of people THINK happened.

And again...you dodged the topic of how you blatantly try to belittle people because of their beliefs...now comparing God to the easter bunny. And also implying that by praying, Christians dodge doing anything. I'd wager I've done a lot more "getting off my ass" in my life than you have.

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It's the same logic, I wasn't here, I didn't see it, so I can just say the world started when I was born...see how that sounds? Sounds just like what you're saying. Can you physically see gravity? No, you see what gravity does. Have you physically seen the earth rotate around the sun? No, but you believe that it does, because it does. Just because you weren't around when something happened, doesn't mean it didn't, when there's all the evidence in the world that says it did. It's what logical people accept, because it's reality, the rest is just denial because of religion. It has the evidence, write it off all you want, it still stands as how we started...nothing else comes to explaining it, definitely not Adam and Eve.


I dodged it? I guess you missed where I explained everything you said I was doing, never said anyone was stupid for believing what they do. Have you seen the Easter Bunny? No. Have you seen God? No. They both have about the same amount of evidence for each other, you can see that "belittling", but it's undeniable. It's like the Flying Spaghetti monster, you can't prove there isn't one, see how that works? And yeah, a lot of them do, but I wasn't saying that when I originally stated that...but go do something or pray about, see which one gets done first...personal responsibility is lacking a lot in religion. And I would hope you have, pretty sure you're older than me, so like I said I would hope so.

But you also cannot explain how the Earth or solar system was created. Its all SWAG on the scientific side. If it was fact, they would know exactly when the Earth and solar system were formed which they do not.

Exactly when? Hardly, modern science hasn't come that far, only an estimated time-frame. As time goes on and technology advances, we'll be able to possible answer questions as precisely as something like that. There's still plenty to be answered, that includes with Evolution, we will advance and new evidence will be discovered to better explain our existing understanding...but you can't write off what we have and fill God in, in the blanks, well I don't and don't think anyone should. Up to them though.

It's pointless to argue with such a backwards, mean spirited, degrading, narrow-minded, atheist, Obama kool-aid drinking idiot such as R13. If everyone was smart on here he would be put on every ignore list and he'd eventually find others to belittle and pester.Pest won't stay long when they have nothing to feed on, and he's definitely a pest.